The latest and greatest on CNN iReport, brought to you by Team iReport.
Tuition is getting expensive. States are cutting university budgets. Professors are being furloughed. Enough is enough, say young, first-time iReporters who are speaking out against the death of education.
Vivid protest photographs and chanting videos flooded iReport yesterday as students and teachers nationwide participated in a “national day of action.” We were thrilled to see so many students and new faces joined the iReport community to help tell a story that’s affecting their generation.
iReporter bluestatus is an aspiring photojournalist and junior at Newark Memorial High School in California. He captured images of parents and children taking their message to the streets of Fremont, California.
Another aspiring journalist and film student, CColton, gathered with his classmates at Colorado State University last week to protest potential tuition raises. The freshman edited together a video that really made us feel like we were there.
Over in the land of Lincoln, new iReporter kpimblo2 helped organize a march and rally of about 300 people at the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign. She’s a graduate employee and doctoral student for history.
“We’re trying to form a coalition of all workers and students on campus,” she said. “We want to put pressure on the state to increase state funding on the university. …The university is threatening to increase tuition 18 percent.”
Student protesters at San Francisco State University got creative with their message, donning giant paper mache ghoul and skeleton masks. Student LandraLune says it was the most dramatic protest she’s ever seen.
“Students are really getting frustrated with the fee hikes and the shortage of classes,” she said. “Many of us are not able to get the units we need to qualify for financial aid.”
If you are taking part in protests on your campus, please share your story. Check out the CNN gallery of iReporters protesting all over the country. The youth of America are speaking, so don’t let your voice go unheard.
I come from the flipside of higher education. I have a PhD. in Computer Science. I've been out of work for more than a year. No college, university, or company wants to hire somebody with a doctorate degree because they automatically think that they will have to pay me an exorbitant amount of money. The problem is that in these tough economic times I'm willing to negotiate salary and benefits; I just never get the chance. I never would have thought that having "too much" education would be a bad thing.
I am 67, retired and not an educator. This is not some emotional appeal for education. It has to do with reason.
I have lived in 3 countries outside the U.S. and it has only made me love the U.S. more. I've worked in a total of 30 countries. The number one priority of the U.S. has to be education. Here's why. It's very simple.
The U.S is competing in a "Global Economic World". The countries giving us the greatest competition for jobs have much lower labor costs and therefore cheaper production costs. The only way to compete is (1) lower our labor costs or (2) improve our productivity(i.e. get more out of the American worker). Since (1) is NOT a goal to aspire to, then we must do number (2). The way to increase productivity throughout history and now is through technology. Technology comes from innovation and invention. Innovation and invention come from lots of education and research. I've simplified it. Of course there are other things, but, technology is key.
If we want our children to compete in a world of international competition we have to educate them like never in our history. It's not that difficult. It is that necessary.
While our competitors are sending their children to school 8 hours a day, 6 days a week and throughout the entire year, we're reducing our investment in our future. Under what social or economic model does that make sense?
We have the ability to do the job. Ask yourself: "Where do many of the other countries send their kids to be educated?". The U.S. is the answer in case you haven't noticed. Education is not just a social obligation it's an economic and survival imperative if the U.S is to provide the living standard and opportunity that my generation has been lucky enough to experience.
Seems to be states with Republicans in control of the state legislatures and governorships where this is happening. Why am I not surprised?
onancockbob - I agree with your assertion about education. The problem is that too few of our dollars are going to the core of education because the public for far too long have bought into the educators line that there's a direct correlation between dollars spent and quality of education. So the money has poured in, and the priority shifted from educating to getting rich. So now the entire system has been corrupted and we'll play hell cleaning it back up !!
TexinVA you can not blame a specific party for the problems state budgets are facing. I could just as easily argue (and probably more persuasively) that it is the democrats social programs that are eating up state budgets for which the education system is suffering. As someone who has a higher degree and works in academia it bothers me to see people just write it off as being "a republican" or "a democrat" problem. The truth is it is our problem and it needs to be fixed by everyone.
In general, I agree with Bob, above, that education is key to both America and the students' futures. With that said, however, we have become too much of an entitlement society. When I was attending college in the 60's (and 70's) there were some scholarships available, and a few grants, but otherwise we were mostly on our own. My middle class family could not afford tuition so guess what? I worked. And worked some more, sometimes two jobs plus college classes. And I was delighted when I eventually got a job at a company with partial tuition reimbursement. Oh yes, it's possible. And as far as public education, in Pennsylvania we "paid to play" for almost everything -- sports, drama, cheerleading, whatever. Were there some kids who could not participate because they could not pay? Yep--no doubt. But whoever told you life is fair LIED. And if you REALLY wanted to be on that football team, etc. and your family had little money, you got an after school job to pay for it.
Further, I was never in a class with less than 30 students, sometimes there were 35 or 36. By some miracle (and in part because of excellent, DEDICATED teachers and encouraging but strict parents) I received an excellent education. Oh, and unless we were outside a two mile limit, we found our own way to school -- WALKING, public bus line, parent drop-off, etc.
Everyone "wants" but few want to "give" in order to get what they want. They want Big Brother to provide -- make it easy -- solve all their problems -- pay all their education bills -- launch them into life. Sorry, folks, that's just not possible right now. Maybe someday our society will be rich enough to do that, but not right now. Soooo...suck it up, cupcake. If you want that education, it's there, waiting for you, the very best in the world. But you have to WORK FOR IT!
You overlook that the cost of tuition has increased far faster than the cost of living.
In MN, a year of college cost $250 in the 60's. Bring that forward to today adjusted for inflation and it is about $1500, the actual cost today is over $8000.
If you had a minimum wage job in 1960 you worked about 250 hours to cover the cost. Today you would have to work 1100 hours to cover the cost - that's a half-time job rather than a few hours a week.
There are very few students who are not working at least half time just trying to keep up, and with reduced availability of classes, it frequently takes more than 4 years to graduate.
This talk about 'entitlement' is garbage. People are working harder than ever and getting less for it. I feel sorry for the kids trying to make it today.
And don't blame the educators - few college professors out-earn their students who are a few years on the job.
Why SHOULDN'T students shoulder the cost of their own education? Everyone is screaming for more state aid - where do any of these geniuses-in-training think that money is coming from?? I'll tell you where - from property owners such as I who are fed up with rising property tax bills with nothing but higher crime rates and crappy roadways to show for it. Many like US didn't get a chance to go to college. Instead we worked our A$$E$ off and managed to buy a home, maybe get married and have kids. In my case, I also have a $19k annual property tax bill, $55K combined fed, state, county and local income taxes. Combined with other taxes, I'm paying nearly six figures much of which goes to insane social programs, and school funding. Meanwhile millions of unappreciative career "students" protest for more blood money from the working stiffs. It's not right. If you're having trouble paying tuition, then log off, take lose the ipod and go pump gas, all night if you have to. Stop looking for a handout from those of us who WORK for a living.
It isn't fair to assume that all students these days expect to have their education taken care of, and are not willing to work for it. I worked and took out loans for everything that my scholarships could not pay for. JimInWi is right. And in addition to tuition, the cost of textbooks has skyrocketed. There is really no reason to charge hundreds of dollars for a book that will be useless in a semester, because a new edition has replaced it.
I just graduated from college this past year, and what students are saying is true. I have had several classes that I signed up for canceled due to inadequate funding, yet tuition continues to increase. Where is our money going?
"Why SHOULDN'T students shoulder the cost of their own education?"
I don't think anyone (well most of us) expects to have our education handed to us. The problem is that as tuition prices continue to increase, the value of education is decreasing.
I'm sure you would be angered by this as well?
I like how someone above said, “Whoever told you that life was fair..LIED.” Well the sword cuts both ways. Yes, you’re paying six figures in property tax. That’s life. Yes, we expect working class people to help cover the cost of our future generation’s education. That’s life.
But you better believe that once our generation finishes school, graduates, gets a job, and starts a family, WE TOO will be working our a$$es off to fund the education of the NEXT generation. THAT’S LIFE.
We understand our place in society, and we’re MORE THAN WILLING to put in the work to do our part for the American people….We just want THE CHANCE to do so. Without access to a quality education, you’re stifling our ability from the start.
And YES, we already do work our a$$es off with numerous jobs, caring for our families/parents and helping pay off THEIR debts, doing community service work, AND putting ourselves through full time school. So don't wag your finger at us saying that we're not trying. This is a different time, and a different generation. Cost of living is up, and jobs are even more scarce. And of top of that, there are CEO's, Directors, and Managers applying for entry level positions that we would normally be getting to help work to pay for our education and bills.
So please don't complain about the young generation being lazy.
“Don’t tell me who to be, until you show me how to become.”
Our young people NEED a quality education in order to become the hard-working citizens that you are asking us to be.
hey owtrageous, there are people working their @sses off now that can't afford to buy a home because all the decent paying blue collar jobs have been shipped overseas. Education is the only way to survive now. But it's been price out of the reach of most. People like you expect public services, without paying for them.
Finally, some reckoning in education. Not much, but a start....I'll take it.
1. Fundamentally, the cost structure of higher education is bloated beyond belief with (a) tenure, (b) defined benefit plans, (c) facility investments (stadiums, pools, etc.) that bear no relationship to improved knowledge or critical thinking, and, in higher education, (d) wsateful administration and (e) revenues disconnected from taxes.
2. And all of this has been hidden by subsidies from the state or federal government. Thus deceiving students and parents into misunderstanding the true cost of current education delivery.
And now look at all the sniveling, whining, and complaining.
Here's a quick Econ 101 lesson for free: No free lunch.
So your choices are:
1. pay up...or
2. shut up and get a job...I understand the food service industry is still hiring in the recession....could I please have french fries with that? Thank you.
"The problem is that as tuition prices continue to increase, the value of education is decreasing.
I'm sure you would be angered by this as well?"
Then if tuition is increasing beyond your ability to pay for it then YOU have to decide if the investment is worth it or not. Don't demand handouts from the state (taxpayers like ME) in the form of aid to help you cover that cost.
"People like you expect public services, without paying for them."
Do you NOT understand the premise of taxation?
At this point, it doesn't even matter any more. Our money is going to be used as play toys before too long. Might as well go to college and learn Chinese because at this rate, that's going to be the next world leader.
When our govt is being manipulated by banks like WELLS FARGO to give them trillions, where will be money left for other things. This was a zero return investment on banks. And lot of money for bailout went directly and also indirectly to banks. That is money down the drain - e.g 180 billion AIG bailout.
This money could surely have been used to fund part of education, rather than fattening the pockets of bank executives. These execs who should have been looking for jobs earned milloins in bonuses of this money without doing anything for thee economy. We should have a congressional investigation how this was allowed?
There is a movement to move your money away from parasite banks and into local credit unions. Search google for "ditch your bank". it makes economical sense too.
And going back to education, we will loose edge in the world, if we compromise on education as a society - plain and simple.
owtrageus (and others who share the same view)
Sorry you didn't get a chance to go to college. Based on your self-reported tax situation, it's clear that you've done well for yourself earnings-ability wise. However, the vast majority of research done over the course of decades reveal that, on average, people with higher levels of education have larger earnings potential throughout there life. State (and local and federal) subisidizing of education is by no means a hand out- it is an investment. The government knows that every dollar invested in high education pays dividends well above the initial cost. The higher wages college graduates (historically) make result in larger income-tax revenue for the fed, and higher sales tax and property tax for state and local.
What is your suggested alternative for students who may choose that the money is NOT worth the investment? Would you advise them to skip school and try to get a job instead? If so, I would wish them a huge deal of luck. It's hard enough getting a job WITH a college degree, but next to impossible to get one without.
And if students WERE to choose that the investment isn't worth it, we'd probably be MORE LIKELY to go on unemployment, and maybe then you could legitimately accuse us of accepting handouts from the state.
Truth is, we are trying our best NOT to ask for these handouts, as you call them, by demanding our right to an education.
The players are possibly all intelligent. So then, it baffles as to the apparent lack of logic in their demands.
The first reality is: It's no secret that the doe is not available. (It's possible they haven't heard about the recession)
So the logical solution is so obvious: hunker down and make the current system more eficient so that the same is done with less. Simple.
Here we go. Let's get a few things straight. If you think back, the US department of education did not come into existance until the 1970's. The biggest "bloat" in our education system is the fact it is now a governemnt agency. The federal government pushes down unfunded goverment mandates to the states who have to figure how to pay for them. Then at the state level like in Oklahoma where I'm from there is an incrediable amount of bureaucratic waste at the state level. This is just dealing with the public education system. Not to mention the crap at the collegiate level. For every $ spend I'm sure we would be shocked at the amount of that dollar that actually touches a student directly.
We also have the same issue with teachers unions that helped bankrupt the auto industry. Tenure, not being able to get rid of underperforming teachers and just plain waste.
And the last point. LIFE IS NOT FAIR. We do not all get to have the easy life. Even if we go to a true socialistic system all we are doing is moving wealth away from private business and move it to government agencies. As much waste as there is in private business, it is nothing compared to the waste of government. If you people are stupid enough to trust a government to cover all of your basic human needs you are crazy. Just like the Cuban movement it is all about power. Look at the average life of a Cuban and the average life of a US citicizen. I don't see many people dying trying to leave the US, but lots dying trying to get in.
Very simple dear: the alternative is to work very hard at SOMETHING and eventually you will reap benefits. You may have to adjust your earnings expectations and live within those means, but it can be done. Afterall, not every employer requires a college degree. Next to "impossible" to get a job without college?? Are you serious?? You are definitely part of the entitled generation with that attitude. As my old man used to say; "the world needs ditch diggers too". And PLEASE enlighten me - where is it written that everyone has a "right" to higher education??? If so, then my "rights" were violated because I wasn't afforded one. Who can I sue to rectify this injustice??
Yes, wellthen86, I may have done well, financially speaking, by standards in other areas of the country but in this part Northern NJ, my salary is probably double the median household income, which is not a lot of money considering that somewhere around 55% goes to taxes in some form or another. There are many like me who are sick and tired of bailouts, social programs and now, ungrateful "students" asking for relief at taxpayers' expense. Many of my friends who had mommy, daddy and the government pay for college + grad and/or law school, found themselves unable to adjust to the real world after being coddled by educational institutions for much of their adult lives. I cringe when I see 30 something "students" complaining about the high cost of tuition while I think of living in a basement apartment working a minimum of 60 hour work weeks, many times above 90 and having little to show for it.
My advice, if not yet understood - get a J O B and pay for your own tuition WHATEVER the cost. Can't afford it? Then no school for you.
its not imposible to find a job without a degree. we always need people to dig ditches, mow lawns, wash dishes. you know, all those jobs that unemployed people dont take. you know, all those jobs that people used to do to pay for thier own education.
that too meanial? try driving a truck, auto mechanic, welder, dental hygenist....
but that's no longer the american way i guess. the government has to pay for it or its not good enough for us anymore.
i'll take someone with a high school degree and 4 years of on the job training over someone with a college degree and no experience every single time.
"I cringe when I see 30 something "students" complaining about the high cost of tuition while I think of living in a basement apartment working a minimum of 60 hour work weeks, many times above 90 and having little to show for it."
This sounds exactly like my life right now, along with plenty other young workers I know of.
I don't think students think they are above any kind of job. A job is a job, and I think that is the underlying sentiment of the times, not the entitled attitude that you speak of.
And I'm sorry if I was misunderstood. I don't believe that higher education is for everyone. I understand that this is a life choice that every person has to make for him or herself dependent on the type of life they choose to live. But I DO believe that A QUALITY EDUCATION in general IS a right. K-12 graders who are affected by these budget cuts are what I'm talking about.
If you read both of my posts, you would see that I was not demanding any handouts. I understand that college costs a lot of money, and that's a fact I have always known. And people like YOU did not pay for my education. My parents are hardworking, middle class people, like yourself, so I was given next to nothing from the government. I WORKED my way through school and took out student loans to make up for what I could not afford. And I am paying them back, NOT my parents. What angers me, is that the quality of education does not match up to what we are expected to pay. I would not have a problem paying for college if classes that I wanted weren't unexpectedly canceled. I hate this assumption that all students are lazy and expect to be provided for their entire lives.
Tell them to shut up! and go back to class!
Ughh, I didn't address that part about "people like you paying for my education" correctly. What I meant specifically was my tuition.
In regards to what public universities are doing with tax payer and students money, I think some big changes need to be made. They need to stop spending so much money on high-tech gyms, and invest it in the classroom.
The cost for higher education is ridiculous! I don't know how the government expects us to afford it. They are cutting out majors at universities which is forcing students to change their majors or graduating early. It's really hard for those of us now in college and it's going to be even harder for the kids of the future. I feel sorry for my brothers who are further behind me and have a lot more college ahead of them to pay for. These officials that are as they call it "trying to help our economy" are actually screwing it up and they have been for years. They are why the country is how it is and it will only get worse. My generation has nothing to look forward to except years of trying to find a job that just might pay more than minimum wage.
The post I made earlier about the states that are cutting education budgets being mostly Republican states is a valid point. They could cut other things. I live in Virginia (A Republican led state) and the governor recently ordered huge cuts in education and health care. The man is an idiot. Those are the two things you shouldn't cut. There are plenty of other places to save money. But especially with education, Republicans who are running for office always say they're for better education yadda yadda yadda, but we now see it's all just political rhetoric.
To those who think education costs (k-12 or university) are bloated: lower salaries, see what you get. Whether you like it or not, education is as vital to the wellfare of this nation as a standing army. Get over your tax bill and quit acting like such victims.
Tuition has gone up 2-5 X the rate of inflation almost every year since I went to college 25 years ago = rip off alert! They do it for one simple reason: because they can. Address that before asking for more, more, more..... Technology (education) will drive future economies (better electronics, cars, green tech, better computing hardware/software, advanced biotech drugs, etc. for our own citizens and to export to other countries). Public education is vital. However, universities are wasteful with what they currently have which has driven up costs. They act just like our government. Extravagant buildings with a large percentage of space that sits empty at any given point in time, bloated pension liabilities, pricey lower level classes which should cost the same as a comm college, gen ed requirements which could be cut out and reduce the cost of a degree by 1/3 (look at where the science jobs are going-- China and India where graduates don't have gen ed requirements-- proof that those classes are not valued by industry), and large sums of money given to universities from private donors which could be used to lower tuition if desired-- but isn't. Look at the "Kalamazoo Promise" which covers 4 years of tuition to any MI college for every graduate from the Kalamazoo Public Schools, courtesy of some anonymous donors. Other cities have similar plans in place. When will parents/students/states/fed wake up and revamp universities to be in line with economic reality before listening to them whine for more money? When will people quit mortgaging their homes, draining their retirements, taking on mega debt, and selling a kidney to pay for tuition that is needlessly in a bubble, ready to pop like the housing market?? Wake up people!!
Have gone to college several times for different degrees, I know this can become expensive. However, knowledge is a comodity. And everything costs money. The one thing I would say is that universities should get into a contract with their clients (students) concerning costs. They do concerning the Degree Plan (CPS). They should have the same rate for 4 years for any given student since that is the length of the degree plan. The student cannot just leave and go to another college in the middle of the Degree Plan because many classess do not transfer. But I do have to say that everyone that complains about school being too expensive (that I know) do have flat screen TVs, fancy cell phones, have multiple children and nice cars. College is like anything else, you have to decide what is more important. You cannot have it all at the same time. So, you know who you are here that are complaining... Can you do mac and cheese, rent a real cheap apartment, drive a clunker that your friends will laugh at and live like a pauper? Then you too can have a college degree. I know some people will say that others come from a rich family. You have to ask yourself what your parents did not do so that you could have rich parents? There are rich people from avery walk of life, every country, ever color... Why is yours too poor? Poor decissions maby? Feeling of entitlement maybe? Maybe they just did not care if their children got college educations! So just deal with it. You can still go if you really want to. I will not be easy financially, emotionally or physically. But you can do it if you want it.
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TexInVA : What you fail to realize is that Republicans beleive that the right you have is to persue something. It is up to use to budget for it. Stop blaming and start cutting back and do without EVERYTHING if you really want to go to college. I know you can do it... if you get out of the mind set it should be easily affordable and it is your right.
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TexinVA...California is controlled by the Dems and it is in the worst state of all. If people started to vote for the best qualified instead of their party, just maybe, the problem could start being addressed. Instead, the first thing out of sheeple's mouths is this party or that party is destroying the US. Whats destroying the US is allowing non-thinkers to vote.
Some interesting views here. Several observations come to mind: to financially struggling students -- do you have to have that degree in four years? You can't work AND go to school at night? Just how badly do you want that degree? In other words, how do you eat an elephant -- one forkful at a time, in small bites if necessary.
Someone above mentioned how "cheap" a college education was in the 60's and 70's -- well, a waiter or waitress was paid $1.00 an hour plus tips. Yes, tuition was much cheaper...but so were wages.
Story #1: My nephew didn't like college and wouldn't stay there even with his (relatively) wealthy father (a graduate engineer) paying for it. Instead, my nephew started a small painting business and worked diligently. In a couple years, with an excellent reputation, he was getting a lot of insurance and commercial work. He now out-earns his father SUBSTANTIALLY. Is a college degree always required? No. But hard work is.
Story #2: I recently needed my hot water tank replaced. The tradesman I hired arrived at the appointment late and profusely apologized, but then did a good job -- he was the owner of the company. He said he couldn't find qualified employees willing to get and keep up with their certifications, and willing to work a full day without texting continuously, taking time off for "personal reasons," etc. His offering wage? $20-$25 an hour, plus regular overtime at time-and-a-half. Seems like $60K per year would be typical for one of his experienced employees. Oh, and layoffs are practically nil -- seems like there is ALWAYS HVAC work needed, in every climate. Now, not everyone would want this trade, and I understand that, however, don't whine on about every good paying job requiring a college degree -- it's just not so.
If you want that college education and are willing to drive a beater car, share an apartment with three or four friends, scrimp and save, work a couple jobs, and maybe take five or six years or more to get your degree, you can. Or, get student loans and then pay them back. Either way, the end result's the same. But you have to really WANT it, and really WORK for it if your family's not wealthy. Unfortunately, there is no "right" to an education beyond the first 12 years. Sorry. It's the way it's always been and still is.
.. Some of our local colleges hire what they classify as "Adjunct Instructors" which are little more than poorly qualified people that they can hire for cheap. One college in particular has someone teaching drafting classes that was fired from 2 seperate drafting jobs, working less than 3 months at both. When this was pointed out to them with a suggestion that the community deserved more they deemed her "qualified". How is a twenty something with a 2 yr associates degree and no experiece qualified? ..
.. and the post before me mentioned problems with tradesmen .. what do you expect when the person teaching them is the same way .. as is the case I was referring to ..
As it happens, one of my good friends is an "Adjunct Professor" at a local community college. She has a Master's Degree in the field she teaches, along with some 25 years of real life, hands on, corporate experience, and she's also authored and/or co-authored nine text books related to her discipline. The classes she teaches are usually filled, since numerous students seek her out for her hands-on knowledge and teaching ability. Does she offer educational value to her students? You bet. So while the drafting instructor mentioned above may be marginally qualified, some adjunct professors are VERY qualified. As an additional note -- college students are "buyers", too. Caveat emptor. If you don't feel a professor is qualified, boycott his or her classes. Don't sign up for them. Take the class from a different professor, even if you have to wait until a future semester.
While it is true that education benefits the society, I have great difficulty believing that these protests are in any way patriotic. Basically the students would be perfectly happy with cuts or other cost saving measures provided they were phased in to take effect the year after THEY graduate. The underlying FACT here is that there is a huge chronic deficit and something needs to be done. If you choose not to cut education, what is it that is better - military, police, healthcare, medicare, medicaide, social security. In reality, if we do not want to end up like Greece or Argentina, we probably need to cut them all, cut quickly and cut somewhat deeply. Pain is coming and we all need to face it and pay our fair share if our country is to prosper.
I was a first generation college graduate. I later attended medical school and law school and am presently working in the medical field. During all of this educational time, I worked incessantly as a waitress, professor or in whatever capacity I could to pay for my schooling along with my parents' generous assistance and the assistance we received from my various universities.
I agree with earlier posters who mention how expensive tuition room and board have become. I was fortunate to attend an Ivy League university for college. My decision was not made because it was the best college to which I was accepted (it was) but because it was the cheapest college with financial aid that my family could afford. I went to high school in NY and in the 90s, tuition room and board, textbooks, fees etc often reached mid20K-30K. Even being alloted the maximum scholarship offered at the time, my state school would have cost over 18K. Yale cost my family around 10K per year and was a vastly superior education. My best friend who could not count on the assistance of her family (who made way too much money and therefore could get limited aid because the government assumes your family will help you pay) took over 10 years to get her college degree and is still fighting to get a graduate degree.
I attended state schools for law school and medical school in part because they were cheaper than private schools because of the limited aid available at the graduate level and have accumulated over 300K in educational debt over the years, all of which must be paid back so it is not a hand out.
To those who believe you can get by without the education, that is true to a point. But consider that not all of us have the technical dexterity to go into the laboring professions. I could never have been a plumber, carpenter, electrician- I don't see in 3D necessary for that (similarly, I could not have been an engineer). I would submit that these skilled laboring jobs still require some form of education that must be paid for. Sure I could have done an unskilled laboring job washed dishes, waited tables, been a secretary (although even that is now requiring some training/college). However, in many parts of the country, the cost of living makes it extremely difficult to make end meets.
Moreover, what a waste for society if those with the intellect and drive cannot afford to attend college and be counted in the professions. I am a damn good doctor, committed to helping my community. I was a damn good waitress because I had a strong work ethic inherited from my parents but I will be able to help far more people in my current job than my former.
Consider also that there are plenty of people who sit at home on the public dole and collect handouts for having one child after another rather than go and work one, two or however many jobs necessary to support their family. We see it all the time in the hospital. A woman with 3 kids before the age of 20, talking about her baby daddies on an iphone and with an expensive manicure and pedicure. Does she work? Of course not. In school, of course not.
A little more work or school for these people and a little less sex and some of the public burden might be relieved.
The students are not endlessly draining our public resources, it is people who work the system.
Ohio62- I agree that sacrifices need to be made but it should not be in education or the meritocracy that made this country great will end and only the children of the rich or upper middle class will be able to pay for college.
Consider Britian, where UK students can attend Cambridge, one of the best universities in the world, as undergrads (if they have the grades) for £3,145 tuition, which is under 5K US dollars.
Also students cannot take out loans for the cost of their entire room and board. It is not permitted even if they have the credit rating. Even if it was, you would be forcing an entire generation to go into professions that might enable them to pay back the upwards of 100-200K depedning on costs. This effectively cuts out teaching, social work, public service, mental health counseling and many essential services in our country.
Everyone being out for themselves is nothing new either. How many politicians have side-stepped the issue of medicare/medicaid/social security? How many older americans want/demand the social security that they expected regardless of whether we can afford it now? How many uninsured/underinsured want medical coverage without paying for it? How many people abuse the system of emergency medicine by coming in for pregnancy tests or upper respiratory infections or vomiting and do not go to a walk in clinic because they do not want to pay out of pocket for even a co-pay if they have insurance?
I was a Part time Intermittent Student who took his Time too slowly Now I wish I would of just went and finished.
Now since that I have to finish up, with my plans to continue after that and High Costs, I might just as well buy a mansion.
Maybe if the Regents had to take 2+ months worth of Furloughs we Students would have lower costs.
My question is: Why can't we file for bankruptcy, to me it does not make sense that we could be forced out of school with such high costs but we can not file for a Chapter in Life.
We see College/University as Higher Education and what I was told lower costs, its the Others who see us as Bait and tackle the New quote should Read: " Lower Education Higher Prices, its the New standard"
BTW: Back when I was young I Realized that Teachers do not always care and I had to teach my self sometimes. it is what we are doing here, learning that life is not always fair, but we can change that. I hope, anyways.
If you want to know where the money has gone and why costs have risen, check out how much school administrators are paid and how they've used the money to hire even more of their own kind. "Revenue Generators" and "Cash Cows:" admin-speak for professors and students, respectively. If you think AIG was fat with overpaid CEOs, take a look at higher ed; it's even worse! A down-in-the-trenches-with-the-students professor.
How about student loans of $127,000 for a 3 year, 'Bachelor of Fine Arts'degree? AND I can't find work in the field of study because certain criteria for that degree were not even offered!
Sorry to hear that shayne, that's a ton of $$. I have that issue with this college I was at. Now I found one that offers what I am going for. I just had to go to a bigger city. and get this, its a bit cheaper other then having to pay rent/dorm fees. so you might want to look around.
I guess if we all drop out, we would prove that our voice is really powerful. That is a figure of speech, That most likely could not happen. but, with prices so High the only ones who can pay are the rich so if they do keep going up that might happen. who knows, Right?
I teach at a small community college in the South. Our budget, which is one of the leanest in our state, has decreased by millions in the past few years. In addition, we have one of the fastest growing enrollments. Because we have an open-door admission policy, well over half of our students have to take remedial development courses before they can enroll in regular college courses. If these students could not attend classes here, they would have few options. I certainly don't believe everyone should go to college, but I do believe the health of a country depends primarily on two factors--having a stable middle class and having an educated populace.
Lottery money was supposed to be used to help fund higher education; however, that "plan" has proved to be deceptive because our state government uses that as an excuse to further reduce our budget.The money goes to assist students financially, and one would assume that colleges then benefit indirectly, but a large percentage of students lose those scholarships by the end of their first year; after that, they either drop out, attend part-time, or take out loans, all of which are real-world choices and consequences. However, the college does not benefit from all of that money "floating around." We simply don't see much of it in the long run, and our state continues to cut our budget. In fact, our budget was further cut by the amount of stimulus money we received, and that stimulus money came with strings attached governing how the money could be spent. Our buildings are falling into disrepair. We're trying to decide which programs to cut. Our only options now are to raise tuition and/or somehow limit enrollment, perhaps by just not offering classes. Either way, the college is hurt, the students are hurt, and maybe our nation is hurt. Higher education is changing, whether we like it or not.
When I was hired twelve years ago, I made less than $35,000. Today, I make less than $35,000, and I don't think I'll ever see $40,000, even if I work another twenty years. I stay because I love my job, but I wouldn't recommend this as a career path to my children.
The schools themselves are to blame here. Especially universities and colleges with major sports programs. These institutions NEED to CAP SALARIES for coaches. No football or basketball college coach needs to make MILLIONS in salary, not to mention the college presidents themselves. Most tenured Professors make a small fraction of coach and executive salaries. We complained about wall street executive pay. This is the same thing. You're struggling w/tuition costs while they're paid like AIG and Bank top brass. My suggestion, BOYCOTT these schools.....stay out a term. Not only would this force a salary cap but it just may force the institutions to lower tuition. You want an education force your college to drop exhorbatant executive pay.
Our government is suffering along w/you the student and parents.
The President runs a country and makes FAR LESS than a conference college coach. Where's the justice? You do the math. less
Why cant they cut sports, The only one's who would complain are the Doctor's who see more Injuries.
Philajamma, perhaps you should withhold the fact that you have a PhD and cap the resume at a Masters Degree and see if it helps. Then you cant complain that they wont contact you because they think they will have to pay too much money. Dont take this the wrong way, but, on the other hand is it your ego which necessitates disclosing the fact that you have a PhD? No offense again but some PhD's cant see the forest for the trees; just saying.
Mark (... with just a lowly Masters Degree outside of the educational arena)
Your current report on faculty and staff salary increases continuing is erroneous, at least as far as the University of California's 10 campuses is concerned. We have not had salary increases for the last few years and are currently included in a furlough program with salary cuts of 4 to 10 percent. Not all universities have rampent salary increases as reported.
victims aren't we all
The issue as I see it, from the perspective as first an outsider to higher ed and then as an instructor at a community college is that we have allowed our governments to be bought by money on all sides.
Example, in CA more is spent on prisons then on schools (from K-20). Why? Because the for-profit prison industry and the powerful prison guard unions have the money to lobby state government for their share. I guess we decided instead of paying first to educate people, we'll pay later to incarcerate them.
The influence of money in addition to a property tax "revolt" and the influence of unfunded mandates from NCLB have left education with no stable funding. In the past 20 years, state funding for state schools have dropped by over 60%. What makes up the difference? Student tuition and fees, that jumped more than 80%.
So, don't blame students, teachers or really administrators. Blame ourselves for not supporting education over the influence of moneyed interests.
Wow. It is amazing to see the differences in opinion across the board. The thing is - no one has a full story, just from their own point of view. This includes me. As I wade into this fray, let me start with my background.
I come from a highly educated family. Most of my family members including grandparents, parents, husband, in-laws, sibling, cousins, aunts and uncles have graduate level degrees. I do not - I stopped at my BA by my choice. I could not think of anything I wanted to study enough to go into debt. Nothing I wanted to do at the time required that level of education. While my parents paid for my tuition, room, board and books for my 4 year education out of their current income - not savings - anything else I wanted to do was on me, including classes with extra fees outside of a lab fee. As Owl62 contends - I worked sometimes 2 jobs at a time - to make money enough to pay for my "extras" during school and then increasingly harder after school to become somewhat successful in the varied positions I have pursued since then.
Politically, I am a Democrat. I believe that education is the key to our survival as a nation and have believed that for as long as I can remember. Most of the degrees in my family have fueled teachers and I have also taught in the public school system - something I would have to have a Masters degree to do now.
Here are some of the other things I would have to have a Masters degree for today that did not require them when I held those positions:
Internet Producer (no longer this title, but I know the similar position requires either an MBA or a computer engineering degree depending on which direction of internet development you go into.)
Store manager (not always required, but at least a college degree is preferred in the area where I live.)
Administrative Assistant - believe it or not, I have seen ads in my local area requiring Admin Assistants to have MBAs.
Supply Chain Management for the US Postal Service - educational requirement of at least 21 hours of business courses, none of which I took for my BA.
Granted, I live in a large metropolitan area - Washington, DC - and educational expectations can be raised because there is such a large candidate pool. However, this is a trend that can be seen in every level of the job market. Even the "ditch diggers" of our society need a higher than grade 12 education now because the ditches they are digging involve complex engineering problems such as "How do I not kill the infrastructure that is already in place by digging a new ditch?" For that you rely upon the civil engineers of the world and their educated work force. In this case, I am talking about workers who have gone through apprenticeship programs - also known as job training.
Do I think that a college education is for everyone? Not necessarily. Do I think that a higher education - as in higher than grade 12 - is for everyone? Probably. Now, before everyone jumps up and down, please let me explain what I mean. I mean that everyone needs education for the job they do. Even the person handing you the french fries at a fast food chain needs to be trained/educated on the machine they are handling.
Do I think that someone with a mind bent more towards medicine or geology or business should be handing someone french fries because they can't afford the education they should have to become a contributing member of society? Not unless they want to.
Now, let's talk about the erroneous concept of a PUBLIC 4 year higher education. I emphasize public because from what I have seen in my state of Virginia, most students do not finish their degrees within the standard 4 years these days. Either they are working one to two jobs so their schedules conflict with the schedule set by the departments they are attempting to get their degrees in. Private schools, however, tend to get their students through their systems in 4 years or less. In fact, when I attended college in the late 1980s you had to graduate in no more than 5 years. I did attend a private school because most public schools in my state would not accept me - a student with a 3.25 average, AP test scores of over 3 and over 1100 on my SATs - merely because I was from Northern VA and there was (and still is) an unacknowledged quota on the area. Today, I have heard of student in public schools having to take 6 or 7 years to finish the basic courses required for their majors. I have even heard of one school which requires not one, but two full time internships for an Events Management major while offering but not requiring any for Civil Engineering. Please tell me where that is sane. (Yes, George Mason - I am talking about you!)
(Opinion continued in next post.)
(Continued from previous post.)
As I was previously saying - a 4 year education for a Bachelor's is no longer feasible at many public universities. When schools don't have infrastructure - buildings, rooms, professors - they have to postpone classes or hold them once every few semesters in order to make the logistics work. One thing that could potentially help in this area would be to look at the classes and create a many to one ratio - many courses to fulfill the required knowledge - and offer at least one a semester. They can also ensure that they do not accept major applicants into a program unless that program can provide the coursework required to move the students through in a timely manner. (Accepting of course that the students pass the class in one go - in other words, get rid of washout courses.)
Now, let's discuss for a moment the costs of going to school. It's not just tuition. It's also student fees, books, room, board, phone, internet, computers - which are required now if you want to sign up for classes, take a test, turn in a paper or even have a conversation with a professor. In some cases classes are only offered online - a great innovation by anyone's standards unless you are the student who can't afford a computer because you have to buy food but you need the college education because you can't get a job in your state without it. Sometimes, the courses offered online only are actually required courses. Again - great innovation but how does someone take that class when they can't afford a computer or Internet access? Answer- the school in question may have to provide that access. Now, how can the school do that without a budget for it?
All of these questions also only touch upon a college education. How about a technical school education? Or a community college education? Or even the partial engineering degree HVAC technicians need to receive in order to be able to fix the high tech systems that exist these days? I don't know of many kids right out of high school working as HVAC technicians without having gone to technical college.
Now, let's talk about our public school system. I live in Fairfax County - one of the more educated counties in the US. Everywhere you turn around you find people with at minimum a Bachelor's and at most several higher degrees. Teachers in this area are faced with the impossible tasks of educating incredibly bright minds and dealing with their incredibly bright parents to educating individuals who don't speak English when they start at the schools and working with their parents who may never speak English. I know that the same issue of language barriers exists across the country and has for generations. My 3 year old son also receives services for special education provided for by the county because while he is a smart cookie (and not just by his parents' estimation) he has Dyspraxia of Speech - a developmental disability that limits speech but can be overcome through intensive speech therapy and special education tools. However, these services as well as other educational programs such as music, art, PE, foreign language and all day kindergarten are on the chopping block because for the first time since I can remember Fairfax County cannot afford its world class educational system.
As for extra curricular activities, we always have had to pay to play in the form of uniform fees, travel expenses, etc. The difference is that the extra curriculars were not required activities for graduation/getting into college/getting a job and today they pretty much are. Add on top of that a required community service component and more homework than I ever experienced in an extremely academic high school it isn't always possible to juggle everything and a part time job to boot just to afford something that has become more of a necessity than a nicety.
In short, we've had a technical revolution and now need an educational one to keep up. Cutting funds everywhere and making being an educator less attractive and more of a factory atmosphere than an intellectual one are not the ways to improve education. Not giving students a way and the means to explore the world around them creatively (and by this I do not mean the just the arts but also and especially the sciences) we will limit our ability to be innovative and thereby limit our global potential.
Will it be hard work? Yes - but the best and most worthwhile things always are.
I graduated college in 2006. It took me almost seven years to complete my BA but I was going to do it if it killed me. I started out at community colleges. I ended up going to a real ghetto one. When I finally transferred, I took as many units as I could, commuted 60 miles a day, worked three jobs and was still so poor that a burger from Carl's Jr was a luxury. I did not qualify for any financial assistance or any payment plan. I too was nickeled and dimed by the system.
I differed from every one of my classmates in the sense that they did not work as hard or make as many sacrifices as I did. I did not know of one of my classmates who actually had a job (unless you count working for your dad). These were the students who always had money for $7 cups of coffee every morning, $25000 cars, ate out every night, etc.
Those classmates of mine are no different than these college students who are not protesting but are throwing a massive temper tantrum.
I say "screw 'em."
I believe the cuts and increases have been far too generous.
Why should I pay more in taxes and have services that I pay for be reduced so some college Art History major doesn't have to get a job or (God forbid!) can't have Starbucks every morning.
My hard work and determination has sheltered me from the recession. I have a good job and I can now enjoy things I only thought of as a college student.
Why should I denied the fruits of my labor so someone doesn't have to work?
There is no name you can call me, no twist of logic or facts or any amount of whining that can change my mind or the minds of the majority who support these cuts.
Sha na na na, sha na na na na,
Sha na na na, sha na na na na,
Sha na na na, sha na na na na,
Yip yip yip yip yip yip yip yip
Mum mum mum mum mum mum
Get a job
There is a brand new website called www.LilysList.com which helps students pay down their student loans through a gift giving network. Won't solve the huge student loan problem completely but it helps.
We americans can never compete with foreign labor. They have people willing to work for a bowl of rice, Child labor and can dump waste anywhere. The sad part is our own people buy these products and sell out fellow americans. Getting an education didn't give guarantees. How about real fare trade agreements. Not the 1 sided dumping ground we have today. They should buy our products as well. How many Chevy's does Japan import?
IM TIRED OF HEARING THAT OUR FEDERAL AND STATE GOVERMENTS KEEP CUTTING FUNDS FOR AMERICANS. WHY DONT THEY CUT FUNDS FOR HEALTH CARE AND EDUCATION FOR ILLEGALS, AND LET THE TAX PAYERS CHILDERN GO TO SCHOOL AT A COST WE CAN AFFORD.
You have to be quite simple not to see that the whole "student protest" movement is simply a marxist front group...hey kids, try not to get too communistic...communism sucks,....bad..
Get loans like everybody else or don't go to college. Do you want a free education - the government provides it! It's called LIBRARY. Half you monkeys have no business in college anyway - your lack of knowledge and intellect degrades the value of my degree.
To those that think college students can work and pay for school, think again. I graduated from SJ State University about 8 years back, even then I had to take classes in the early morning, some afternoon and some evening. Who would hire people who can't stick to a certain schedule? - Only minimum wage jobs. State University was affordable back then, but UCs and private schools were not. UCs and private schools were not my option because I just could't pay for it.
Still I do believe students should work part-time while studying. Work experience gained is just as valuable as studying.
Get loans - life isnt free. Stop being MR liberals.
These people demostrating are entitlement babies and spoiled. Out of all the states, California for many years offered the lowest tuition in the country and now they have to pay the price for doing so. In Virginia, which has some of the lowest taxes in the country, I paid nearly $100 per credit hour for community college courses. I am currently paying $500 per credit hour attending out of state at University of Maryland, University College. It's taken me nearly 11 years to accomplish what I have been to course-wise because of illness and poverty. I chose to pay out-of-pocket for my associates' degree because I didn't want to burden either myself or my state by taking financial aid because I knew there were student's in more dire straights than myself that needed what little financial aid that was available to the general population.
You protestors are the most selfish, spoiled rotten people out there. You are too self-rightous and self-entitled to realize that you would be helping the general population of the state by making these sacrifices. But no. Californians aren't tough enough to do this. California boo-hoo, whine, and start shooting when their toys are taken away. Disgusting.
Man up, you spoiled brats.
Y'all communist students gotta stop trying ta take welfare for ya education. Who needs an education!! All education doez is make liberals!! Listening ta Rush Limbaugh is the only education I needed and look at me, I'm married to only my second cousin (got divorced to my first cousin) and I own my very own trailer. What has science and education every done for society?!?! Y'all should stop crying about the cost of college and come join me and my tea-baggin' GOPers back in the stone age. Time to grow up and realize that GOD HATES EDUCATION!!!(and liberals!!!)
Just think. I think all those trendy Californians that bought imported cars (majority)and put American taxpayers out of work should just go ahead and pony up the extra taxes themselves.
China and India greatly appreciate the viewpoints of those who support higher USA education costs. They really support pricing education out of reach for most USA students, as they graudate millions of engineers every year.
They also appreciate forcing students to take jobs, as devoting half their productive time to flipping burgers will ensure that their education will be less effective, and they will be unlikely to enhance USA competitiveness.
Don Lemmon and Wolf had had a student on about protests against education cuts. your guest encouraged them to blame the workers because they're paid too much. give me a break, many have gone without raises, have been furloughed, hadtheir pay cut, etc. most of these workers are the parents of students that are struggling to make ends meat and get a good education. you had a professor on that said he took a 10% pay cut and living like a grad student. the corporate defender should have been challenged on this reality. why shouldn't the very wealthy pay a fairer share? why does wall street, big oil, pharma, the wealthy (those who have benefited from bailouts and tax cuts) always get a pass while the working poor, middle class and students are expected to pay more. i think you know the answer. students...don't let the corporate mouth pieces (in all colors) divide you in your vision for a fairer economy. divide and conquer is the oldest strategy...continue to ORGANIZE!
If you compare college amenities now with those of the 1970's when I was in college, you can see why tuition has risen so much faster than inflation.
In 1970, a summer job saved 3/4 of my U of Maryland system tuition of $786. Part time work the rest of the year covered the rest, books, and gas to commute from home. Today, a summer job can barely cover 1/3 the $9000 tuition and hundreds in books.
Why? The cafeterias in 1970 were the grab-a-tray and pick from a few selections - Community College's typically still have them now. But my alma-mater, UMBC, now have an expansive, skylit, potted-plant filled cafeteria with knockoffs of MdD's, Subway, KFC, Pizza Hut, etc.
Instead of the typical 2-people to a room dorms with a payphone and a common lavatory/shower room in the middle of each floor, there are "suites" with their own kitchens, etc.
The gym has a track between the first and second tiers of seats, and the weight equipment is extravagantly plentiful.
The new labs and planetarium are also state-of-the-art and it seems no expense was spared.
Those things all seem nice, until you realize that what's been created is a country club for the wealthy or something that puts a severe financial hurt into middle-class parents.
A lot of my high school students, who could have worked their way through a four-year college a generation or so ago, couldn't even dream about it from the 90's on.
This talk of 'entitlement' and 'you need to work for it' is garbage. I'm a veteran and a college student. I don't go to an expensive school, I ride public transit, I work 30 hrs a week, take at least 15 hrs of classes, and my wife works full time. We have no debt, but we barely get by.I don't want to hear this crap from people saying we don't need to spend more money on education, we do. I gave years of my life to the military and some of my friends gave their lives, so yeah I feel a little entitled to an education, but funding for education is the first thing to go. You damn people saying we need to work more or need to save more have no idea, you've been out of school for 20 to 30 years. This crap makes me sick, what the hell did I serve for, if the one thing that will make me able to provide a life for my family, education, becomes too expensive for me to obtain?
I was far better off opting for higher studies outside the USA For sure the cost of education is very high in the USA for the standards and moreover even for good standards education should be cheap only then you can have a healthy society. USA was once a land of opportunities by recently I would say it is a land of scams. USA once upon a time had innovations and breakthrough technologies but now everyone has it. So whoever does good business with ethics will have economic might but to hold on to past glory USA is going to lengths to bomb other countries to listen. This is not good for yanks because the net result is you will only get bad name and your money earned would be shor term all your punch dialogues would only last overnight you have to show integrity honesty etc by action by not by words so USA has to improve and not show big brother attitude.
I am Director of Financial Aid at a college. All students qualify for Federal Financial Aid at some level. If a student doesn't qualify for as much federal aid, attend as many classes as you can pay for and get a job. It may take longer to get the desired degree, but the student is still progressing. The federal pell grant is FREE money from the Federal Government for students to help pay for school. The maximum award has increased every year, and will continue to increase for the 2010-2011 academic year. I really do not understand what the problem is. Continue attending classes. Go at the pace that you can afford. That's how life works. Nobody is going to GIVE you a new home, a NEW car, or anything else. You have to work for it. You have to SAVE for it. Good Luck and Study Hard.
"Nobody is going to GIVE you a new home, a NEW car, or anything else. You have to work for it. You have to SAVE for it."
Well, duh. I think most students who are at the colleges being hit hardest by this (e.g. UC system) are used to earning what they get. Don't believe me? Walk a day in their shoes. Grades aren't given there, they're earned on a hard and fast learning curve.
The problem is that people in the middle income bracket ARE NOT being awarded Pell Grants, because they don't qualify for them. However, their fees are being raised to foot the bill for the students in lower income brackets. Parents can only pay, or are only willing to pay, so much. I attend a UC, and the VAST majority of students I know are working at least one job, and MOST are working 2 or more. So to say that we are spoiled brats is just plain ignorant.
The President of UC, Mark Yudof, makes $800k per year. That's about 3 times as much as the President of the United States. He has refused to take a pay cut, while raising student fees 32% in one quarter. And you people wonder why students are infuriated???
"You protestors are the most selfish, spoiled rotten people out there. You are too self-rightous and self-entitled to realize that you would be helping the general population of the state by making these sacrifices. But no. Californians aren't tough enough to do this. California boo-hoo, whine, and start shooting when their toys are taken away. Disgusting. Man up, you spoiled brats."
No, actually, I'm working 3 jobs, taking 24 units, and maintaining a 3.8+ GPA at one of the top ranked public universities in the world. In my free time, I write scholarship essays. Did I mention that I'm footing my own bill? Grow up man, you look like an idiot calling out people when you don't even know their situations.
Someone who did NOT protest, DID write Sacramento and DOES take personally being called a spoiled brat.
Is everybody prepared for the Truth? You have about 2 weeks until the whole truth is out. What you thought, became a reality-fact.
Ok let me chime in on this subject. In reference to a college education, there are many many ways to get one, a job would be the first and main choice. Also to go with that, if you bust ur *** early on a scholarship. But the ppl that really get under my skin are like owtrageus, hey buddy I myself came up in a low income family, I'll put it out there I'm in my Mid twenties, so if anyone can relate to these kids, its me. You did not put me through any kind of school. I worked odd jobs since I've been 13 doing everything for myself. I put myself through K-12 and college. You pay your six figures in taxes not for some gvnt bail out, not for anyones education. You pay it because you have to, I pay taxes and as you can tell by my screen name, I work for this country. Your money comes over here, to afghanistan. Belive me 95% of taxpayer money ends up over here. Now, I do agree with you in the fact that, you DO NOT NEED a college degree to be successful, at one point i was 21 working at MACY's as a dept mgr making good money. My problem exists with our cuts in the K-12 area. To, simply put it, do we want Un-educated people running our lives when were old in 50 yrs ?? If we dont give our young kids a good education now, then WE WILL PAY THE PRICE once they take over our gvnt. Many 17 somethings are joining me here in Afghanistan, putting their lives on the line for an education. Thats sacrafice, so for those who think your doing something for us by "Paying Your Taxes". NEWS FLASH! your not !. College isnt for everyone, this is true but all students should have an oppurtunity to one, its our job to make sure our future is a good one. We need our teachers in schools, not sitting at home because some beaurucrat (spelling) sitting on some board decided to cut funds out of a school district. If we as a gvnt spend money on a good quality education, then we are setting ourselves up for a good future. Oh, and for the record, i put myself through college on 2 jobs and got a bachelors in Forensic Psychology, and I still joined the ARMY. Not for the education benefits because that will go to my kids in the future (doing what I need to, to secure a good future).
Folks, we have been living beyond our means for a long time. We have been playing keep up with the Jones' for too long and it finally caught up with us. Because a lot of FAT CATS basically sit on their butts and still have money pouring in and regular workers are being punished for wanting to be treated with dignity, our desire to have a work ethic has been destroyed.
We were asked to embrace technology and the jobs it would create and then we shipped the jobs overseas for cheap.
What is the point of getting a degree if the corporation takes the job and sends it to India before even looking here? Our best and brightest minds are going to Wall Street to steal money from the rest of us suckers.
The problem is that Americans have celebrity and money status rubbed in their face every day and it devalues and even denigrates having a real work ethic.
American workers are considered the most productive workers in the world. We produce more per capita that anyone, yet not only do the corporations not appreciate that they still just treat people like toilet paper and papar clips, an expense that has to be cheaper and cheaper. The company's don't have loyalty to their workers and they were subjecting their workers to slave-like environments. That is why Unions had to be formed. Because we can't enforce labor laws in other countries we don't see the horrible conditions that they work in.
But American consumers are to blame as well. We keep wanting things cheaper and cheaper and guess what? You can only go so low. If you don't feed the cow, how do you expect to get the milk?
This event in history should be known as the "Great Correction". We need to correct our values, correct our financial houses, and correct our society and it's inequities. We have a lot of work to do.
The main problem is that our public educations systems have become static and over bureaucratized. At the state universities, the number of programs and staff multiplies while the professors and grad students deal with stagnant salaries and stipends. Also, there are many baby boomers that are the highest paid, and they're not retiring in this bad economic season. When they do, younger professionals will take lower salaries and fill their positions. So it's not just more public money, it's how wisely and effectively the money is spent. California is a case in point, need we say more?
There are many bright and talented young people who would be wasting their potential flipping burgers and cleaning restrooms if it weren't for scholarship and grant programs partially funded by our taxes. Helping to pay for the education of these people is an investment in our country's future success in the world global marketplace. Would we rather see high tech and professional jobs go to foreigners and our country become a nation of minimum wage workers?
Education is important, but not nearly as important as experience. The only thing one receives in school is information...it doesn't become knowledge until it is used. I am educated, but I have learned that if I want something done I had better ask someone who has "done" it before, not studied how it was done. If I need something studied, I will ask a pH.D, but getting something accomplished requires the bold, not the educated.
Now the "educated" never like to hear that, and much more often than not they argue with me, but the logic is simple and the only way they can win is to flood the conversation with information. They have a ton of information, but little knowledge and even less wisdom. It's at about then that I pick up my things and walk away before they get themselves so riled up they are ready to force their opinion....the greatest step of ignorance known to man.
America needs to DO things, not study them. We need to be bold instead of pensive in the journey to wisdom. Our government has forced the "bold" to "do" in other countries by putting heavy requirements on business by way of environmental regulations, tax regulations, labor regulations and guess where the theory of those "regulations" start...in our educational institutions.
It is a vicious cycle that is eating at the root of this country and until logic triumphs over information, we are doomed to repeat every mistake ever made in the history of mankind because we keep trying the same failed solutions that have been "improved" in theory by theorists...not industrialists.
Keep kicking butt!!! You are of the few that are working on your education AND solving problems everyday...that is what will make you great, if you stay humble and keep pressing everyday you will earn the rewards you search and will receive more as you progress towards your goals.
"We're trying to form a coalition of all workers and students on campus" - oh please move to a leftist country where education and work are "human rights" not priviledges! This mentality is straight from the old Soviet Union and Cuba where everyone is educated and works, but no one can earn a decent living. I hope the US doesn't have to repeat the failed leftist policies that have never worked anywhere.
Education is a PRIVILEGE not a right. And not everyone NEEDS a college/university education. And if you live in a BLUE state that believes that the GOVERNMENT is supposed to give you and education. You need to wake up and smell the coffee.
Tuition in TX schools is $400/hr for in-state students and $800/hr for out-of-state and foreign students. Also the High-School grads are of such poor quality, they have to be placed in remedial math classes for the first year to get them to speed.
And its not a bad idea to drop degree programs that graduate less than 100 people per year to save money.
My daughter is a senior at a public university in Virginia. The tuition/room/board continues to rise that it has become increasingly difficult for her to get enough financial aide to pay for her last year of college. She will be a senior again next year and will graduate 2011. The cost continues to rise but the amount of aide that the students are qualifying for is not enough to cover the cost. On top of that, she is majoring in Education and will have a hard time finding a job since all of the districts all over the U.S. are having to cut staff by the hundreds. My husband is also in grad school and will graduate next December. His masters will be in Guidance Counseling but his chances of getting a job will be very difficult due to all of the cuts. When I hear of all of the programs being funded by the state and federal government that could be cut or delayed in order to put that money toward Education, it just amazes me. Education should be the last program that faces any cuts in funding. Our class sizes now are already too large and as staff continues to be cut, class sizes are going to grow. When the classes are too large, it is impossible to give students individual attention. Also, classroom management becomes highly difficult the larger the classroom of students. Lawmakers need to look at programs that are unimportant and cut those programs instead of cutting anything related to Education.
This is really ironic. Over the past decades, college campuses have championed every money-spending and tax-base diluting social reform that has come down the road. The potential wealth of US capitalism finally has been squeezed dry. Our GDP can no longer sustain the wanton social 'give away' ethic. Our recent problems have just brought it into the open. Face it - there isn't any more money for you! You helped give it all away! The reason your tuition payments are so high is taxpayers are footing the bill for more 'needed' social programs. At least they were considered more important when all those 18- and 19-year olds and their academic 'mentors' were voting to throw money at them. You wanted 'change', right? Sorry, but 'chump change' is all that's left. You wanted to talk the talk, now ya gotta walk the walk. Pay up and take your job at McD's. No less important is our currency is purposefully being devalued to achieve 'globalization'. Another great idea - not. Billions are being printed and circulated so we can buy ourselves out of the recent collapse. Some day college tuition will cost $10,000 a credit hour and a dollar will be worth one yen. Enjoy your bed. PS - before you go ranting about this comment, I got the BA and the MA; a good liberal education.
I guess it's a matter of what is really important to you when taking a stance on education in this country of ours.It seems all too clear to me that conservative politicians want an ignorant electorate in order to protect the pocketbooks of the wealthy.Listen to our right wing politicians and hear them tell us where their priorities are.No on health care, because your health means nothing compared to their wealth. Yes on cutting spending on education not just to reduce their taxes but to help maintain their base.
I am surprise to see they can spell. Schools in this country are going down hill; they only teach student how to pass a minimum standard test.
Let's reflect for a while. Did any of us see the media highlights the importance of the education movement and among the working class? The answer is no. Apparently, the nationwide protest, albeit small compared to let's say the "tea-party" is not worth capturing its importance. This is a headline worth emphasizing!!! Do the politicians care about the higher education subject? I have yet to see one publicly elected politician make a single statement to backup the protests out there. Are we this numb?
Wake up America, if we are to compete in this global economy, let's put some priorities on higher education and its affordability. Everyone should be the chance to attend college, including the middle class...
Here's a story. In the mid-seventies, my father was in college to get his degree in engineering. One summer, he took a part-time job installing windshields at a car factory in Cairo, IL to help pay for school in the fall. Guess how much he got paid? $25 per hour. Thankfully, he turned down the offer to work full-time there, and finished his degree in engineering. Otherwise I'm sure he would have been laid off if he stayed in the auto industry. I have my bachelor's degree in business. I am finishing up my master's degree, and I am working part-time as an administrative assistant to pay for school. Guess how much I get paid? $11 per hour. I understand the frustration of older generations that students feel "entitled" to a college education today. Well 25 or 30 years ago, somebody didn't need a college education. They could theoretically work at GM their whole lives without a college degree, and still have enough money to raise a family and have a middle class existence. If China and India educate only the top 10 percent of their population, it is almost more than America's entire population. For America to even compete, we should be encouraging all of our students to attend college. If they don't have the aptitude, we then should encourage them to go to trade school. Bottom line, while older-generations may not like paying for education, we don't like paying for your social security. Do you really think if the average American is getting by on a $9 per hour job "digging ditches", that you will be getting any social security checks? It is simple math...
The term "entitlement society"- or the idea conveyed by this phrase- seems to be used quite generously.
My classmates and I are not evoking some sort of right to free higher education; the protests are conceived as a movement against the constantly increasing tuition and housing. As a Cal undergrad, I find it difficult to watch students drop out because they and their families can no longer afford the 32% tuition increase from last year. We are not begging for scholarships, we are pleading for an affordable education, as it should be!
How sad when students are stocking up on loans and working multiple jobs in order to earn a bachelors, masters, PhD, etc, and some older college grads are telling them to "suck it up" and "college isn't free." UC tuition is 15 TIMES what it was in 1979 ($635 vs $10302). However, minimum wage was $6.27 in 1979 and $4.41 in 2007 when adjusted for inflation.
Students are sick of paying more while making less (most working undergrad students earn around minimum wage). Again, this isn't about students thinking they will get a free higher education; they can no longer afford higher education even if they work throughout college! Tuition and housing costs are ridiculous!
TexinVA: Did you even read the article? Illinois is as blue as it gets, and they have the worst problem in the country behind CA. Our State is in such debt that they cannot even afford to pay the interest on the obligations to the public pension system. The social spending here is so out of control, and the business environment so unfriendly that, if we were to increase the income tax rate by 50%, we would still not close the gap.
as a student of the cal state system, there is one question i really need answered. why do we have remedial classes that cannot count for a degree offered at a university while university-level classes are being cut by the dozen?
i asked the same question to the csu system via their twitter account back in october and this is their response:
@menorman I hear you...it's a valid question to ask. I know we are working on addressing remediation and if I get more info I will send 2 u.
2:19 PM Oct 21st, 2009 via web"
i'd like to know how far along they've come with a plan to address the situation since then. spring quarter is near which also means fall registration is coming up quick and if there are remedial classes offered in the fall quarter, something is wrong.
there is no reason that there should be multiple sections (or even a single one) of the equivalent of 8th grade math offered at a university when there are several community colleges in the area. it's also a double insult to the minority of students who actually pay tuition and were unable to take a class because it was cut because a third of the tuition fees (which have gone up almost 50% in the last year and a half) fund the student grants. i would not be in the least bit surprised to find that most of the people in remedial classes are receiving free money to cover their education courtesy of those who pay their own tuition but can't even take university-level classes that they need to graduate because they were cut.
so yea, in the future, when classes need to be axed, the remedial tree needs to be the first to go. education at a community college is only $26/unit anyway, so there is a major savings to be realized by leaving the remediation business to them.
I have news for these protestors - education won't necessarily get you a job! I have 2 graduate degrees, one in law which is supposed to be "useful for everything", and I got 1 interview out of the hundreds and hundreds of applications and conversations I had with people hiring. Started my own business, not turning a profit yet because nobody is spending.
@law2em, who wrote:
"Consider also that there are plenty of people who sit at home on the public dole and collect handouts for having one child after another rather than go and work one, two or however many jobs necessary to support their family. We see it all the time in the hospital. A woman with 3 kids before the age of 20, talking about her baby daddies on an iphone and with an expensive manicure and pedicure. Does she work? Of course not. In school, of course not."
Have you seriously never heard of welfare reform? Where have you been for 15 years, under a rock? You can't get welfare without working. Check it out before you spew your uneducated opinion on a national website.
these students vote for more and more free government programs....so it is only right that they now have to help pay for some of them.....so, they may need to get a few jobs to help pay their way in todays world. economics 101, nothing is free, someone has to pay for the ones that won't. groups like acorn with the help of minorities and ignorant young people have milked the system for billions of tax dollars.
I know this is old, but I had to comment before reading on.
Paying taxes near 100K, you are not blue collar.
The richest people are not the educated, but gamblers and thieves that have taken advantage of others people bad luck or ignorance.
Exactly what do you produce for your large income, I would guess it's merely managing your assets obtained as stated above.
Teachers, engineers, technology experts don't get rich using their education they worked so hard to earn, because they actually produce a product.
The problem with the USA right now is people are making all the money not actually producing a useful product of any kind, they just manage money and make money on money...that is a spiral to trying to eat, wear and sleep on money.
If you aren't willing to fund education, don't complain the next time you go to the doctor and get an India one you can't understand.
If you aren't willing to fund education, don't complain the next time you get poor service for anything.
You reap what you sow, pay now or pay later, any business person will tell you education has the potential pay off the most with minimal investment.
Trying paying $40 K per year to keep the truly uneducated in prison.
If America is ever going to get out of the hole it's in, there is simply one solution. Education, quality education. This will enable the next generation to lead not via labor but via innovation and technology. Education should simply be the absolute last thing that gets cut out of budgets.
Hey I have an idea, if we really think education is not that important, then lets just put all the kids to work?
That's what happens in other countries.
Why wait until college to shut out those who can't afford it? Heck, charge parents to send their kids to school. This is what happens in other countries.
What insanity is this? I spent 20 years working my way up in a company until nepotism kicked me out. Guess what, experience is not nearly as transferable as a degree is.
So I returned and graduated, doing 4 years in 3. My family suffered, but I did it!
We have now sacrificed everything to get two kids through college with the 3rd one almost done. They are making more than both parents.
Student loans alone won't cover college. We've gone into heavy debt with parent plus loans.
People say, get a job and work your way through college. I say BS, don't let a nickel dime job take time away from studying Calculus, Physics, Organic Chemistry, Micro-Biology. I had a tutor in Calculus that dropped out to work full time at Wal-Mart. Imagine a student smart enough to TUTOR IN CALCULUS blowing his chance for a college degree because he needed money to live on for a couple of years?
We need to INVEST into the future of our kids, because they will be ones taking care of us, when we can no longer take care of ourselves.
AMEN, finally people that can come to a mutual agreement. Now all we need is the people in DC to see that, alright we're cutting costs on education. How will that effect us in hmmm let's see 20 years? You know a movie comes to mind when I think of this current situation we find ourselves in. America, the country of oppurtunity, where you can do anything you put your 100% to, turned into a country of bumbling morons who can even make heads or tails out of the most common ideas. Do we want a country like that or a country where anyone can prosper ? Cutting education should be the last thing on the chopping block, because as many people have stated above me, we have Masters Degree holders greeting you at Walmart. Invest and keep the money in education now = a better and brighter future for us. I don't know about anyone else out there, but once I'm done with my ARMY time, and once my life is said and done, I don't want an un-educated person running my country and making flawed decisions because...drumroll please.....we cut costs in the education department 40 years earlier. I'm just saying..
I hold a BS in engineering and also serve on the local school board. I am appalled when I see the demands that we get from everyone from the custodians to the administrators when it comes to contract negotiations. We can't settle a contract for less than 3.5 to 4.0 % yearly wage increases, despite the fact that, in our area, large numbers of our citizens have either been laid off or have had wage freezes or reductions. In addition, teachers contribute less than $500/year to health care. Compare that to private corporations. The cost of the teachers pension program are about to ruin the district financially. Our state related universities are raising tuition rates at a 2 to 3 % faster pace than inflation. The solution to our problem is not to throw more money at it. The solution is to hold the line on ridiculous salaries, incredible pension plans and other benefits, and to hold districts accountable for their performance teaching our children!
Just where do you get your information on teachers contributing less than $500 for health insurance. This year, a family plan was going to be equal to 1/4 of my net pay...one week per month would go for family health insurance.
Many states are trying to freeze teachers wages, yet we are required to continue to pay out of pocket for continuing education...what other profession requires that?
Tuition Scam, bloated pay for administrators and profs.
In 1956 I paid $85.00 bucks for a quarters tuition and made $1.25 an hour part-time at a bakery and finished college not owing a dime.
DonkeyPhant politicos, CorpRats, and entrenched educational elitists are telling our youth--
to hell with you-we want only those with wads of dough and/or excessive loans to pass through the myopic doors of higher-ed.
I'm glad students are protesting. In a day where a colledge degree is essential, it's harder to obtain it due to financial contraints. It would be like charging someone in the 60's and 70's to go to Highschool. I feel their pain, I started college in the late 90's, graduated early 2000's and still struggling.
College's should be up-front with students choosing their majors. They are falsely advertising themselves to get students in and once they graduate they get a job in their field that only pays $9.00 an hour and are stuck with a $30K loan bill. There needs to be some early intervention that says "I don't think this field will be good for you if you have to finance college yourself".
For those who falsely believe that education is the hope of saving this country, here are some facts.
Firstly, let us not fool ourselves, schools are not the only place to gain knowledge. Many of those who pursue education are degree seekers rather than knowledge seekers. Once they got a degree and land a job, their quest for knowledge is over. Unfortunately even for these people education is not a sure way to a job as of today, and less likely in the future. China's education system cranks out more grads than the US does. Almost half of their grads becomes jobless as soon as they step out of school. You don't want to waste your money like that, do you?
Secondly education is not a sure way to innovation. Some school is needed in advancing science and technology. But innovation is not about education. Otherwise the country with the greatest number of college grads would have been the largest country of innovation. But that has not happened. In fact you can have a million would-be Einsteins without have a real one. It is not about education.
And thirdly innovation is not the way to insure a prosperous future for the next generation. As a matter of fact, the US has been, and still is, the biggest technological innovator in the world, and you have seen what happened to its economy... On the other hand, countries with not as many innovations are becoming prosperous.
Students should shoulder the responsibility of paying for college. For too long, we have thought of college as our 'right' when in fact it is a 'priveledge.' High School is a right; college is a priveledge. Perhaps people will start valuing education and work harder in pre-college classes if they know that grades will get them to better colleges and give them scholarships. It's funny....spend $30,000 on a new car and not $16,000 per year in your future? Do the comparison. Stop complaining about everything! If you want it bad enough, you'll find the money!
Crises Produces Opportunity for Growth.
Education needs to begin to think out of the box in regards to providing classes and teachers. This is true for college and public education(1 through 12th grades.) Why are we not in the 21st century? All of the electronics we have we can have top notch teacher teaching thousands of students providing an opportuntiy to receive a top notch education.
Gates may explore and fund these electronic class rooms in proverty areas.Economy is difficult.Now is the time to cut the amount of classes and teachers who are not fulfillg their need to teach adequately. Perhaps the olden days are over with over filled classrooms and poor teachers not teaching. Our limited resourse demand we up grade and down size our thinking about education and the delivery systems that are failing.
I personally believe all education through udnder graduate should be free. Graduate school needs to be based on pay back time of using the skills they hav acquired to help other in a set time frame.
""There is really no reason to charge hundreds of dollars for a book that will be useless in a semester, because a new edition has replaced it.""
as celtic posted above--THIS is the problem. the colleges have gotten so used to milking the system that people think the answer is to get the govt to pay the outrageus fees of the college rather than forcing the colleges to lower their fees.
when a college professor writes a new text book for his class every year and that text book costs 50-100 dollars---you figure out who is raking in the money and where the problem occurs.
instead of asking other tax payers to pay your college--work on reforming the college so it doesnt cost so much.
someone else said
-college cost have far outpaced the cost of living. ask yourself WHY? someone is making moneyotherwise it would only have kept up with living cost.
The President of UC, Mark Yudof, makes $800k per year. That's about 3 times as much as the President of the United States. He has refused to take a pay cut, while raising student fees 32% in one quarter. And you people wonder why students are infuriated???
and there you have it. Instead of confronting the problem--ie schools charging too much, the students will ignore that and instead try to pass that outrageous cost to taxpayers.
a president of a university making almost three times as much as the POTUS? making about 20 times as much as a soldier getting shot at in Iraq?
therein lies the problem. that and the fancy dorm rooms, luxury gyms etc. College has ceased to be about an education and has turned into a luxury spa.
fix the problem--dont pass on the cost of the problem to someone else.
I truly hope that everyone who sees Mores new movie: Capitalism A Love Story, truly takes notice and understand that the American system of Congress and The House is doomed to fail and has done so for over 50 years.
It is unjust, the people don`t have the last say and regulations can be done without a single trace back to the ones who try and influence the different members.
It is too easy to make laws and regulations in the congress and most of the people there don`t seem to care for either the country of America, nor its people.
You, the people of America must voice your opinions, no matter if you are red or blue, and make the system change from the ground up.
Obama can’t do it himself, he needs you, the people, to say enough. Everyone must see that your system is truly broken and that investing money in, for example, The military, is just crazy. Do you need a private army? Hell no!
Please, make some changes, make America more stable and try to support each other. Socialism is not evil, if done moderately. You can still have private industries, but make sure they do it not for profit, but for the common good, or to enrich their lives, not with money, but with a meaningful existence.
Universal healthcare, god infrastructure, insurances that work for you, not the companies and basic university education for all, free of charge (believe me, it is possible, we have it here in Sweden) based on your grades, not income. That should be basic things and you support it with a nice enough tax rate, that go up if you make more money. It is not unfair, think of it this way. You put some money in to the pile in order to make a better society that will run more smoothly, and you will get a better education rate in the process.
That`s all for me